Again you are making the same logical fallacy that all the pro-smackers appear to make – you seem to think that good parents have to smack

it isnt a matter that good parents have to smack its that you are considered a bad one if you do.

Good parents dont say that smacking is good in fact they would nearly all say that when you have got to that point you have probably missed some alternatives, but it is important to children to know that their parents have authority over them and smacking is part of this.

lack of discipline can be a form of abuse.

If you support families you should recognise the authority within them to decide the best means of discipline for their own family and not impose yours.

Again you are making the same logical fallacy that all the pro-smackers appear to make – you seem to think that good parents have to smack. Supporting families has nothing to do with corporal discipline. I support families and I don’t support corporal discipline. And it’s not merely imposing for the sake of imposing as though I’m some busy-body with too much time on my hands. The reasons for against corporal discipline have be repeated over and over and I’m not repeating them here. Parental authority has its limits and I think the limits lay in one place and you believe it lays elsewhere. I do support parental authority but it’s not unlimited.

It is the parents who believe that smacking as a corrective measure is appropriate, who are being demonised.

That may or may not be true – however, what you said above was hyperbolic and doesn’t help the discussion.

If what you say about your own upbringing is correct then surely this means education is the answer. Instead social engineers have resorted to change by decree.

If you support families you should recognise the authority within them to decide the best means of discipline for their own family and not impose yours.

Scary White Conservative with a Banjo: I’m not going to argue about analogies as we can be here all day. However, the analogy is that since drinking beer on the beach isn’t the only way we can drink, then it’s reasonable for it to be prohibited if it’s causing problems, even if the majority do it responsibly. Just as corporal discipline isn’t necessary and parenting has far more to it than corporal discipline then it is reasonable to prohibit corporal discipline if problems are arising, which they are. It’s not like banning all alcohol since no-on is banning parenting.

Perhaps section 59 Crimes Act could be written better – but that’s true for a lot of legislation. Have a look at the Income Tax Act and tell me what that means – and that affects all of us every day. The Courts have always had to interpret legislation and in particular the term “reasonable” so there is nothing new here. That’s just how legislation works..

Dei Verbum: You stated that those that are opposed to corporal discipline “are more interested in attacking traditional family values than the actual welfare of children”. That’s absolutely nonsense. Are you saying Caritas is interested in attacking traditional family values? I oppose corporal discipline and I very much support families. One shouldn’t demonize one’s opponents, as once that is done there is no chance for dialogue.

You may not have seen a look of love on the face of a parent when they have given their child a light smack but I certainly have… there was no fear engendered either but a reminder that what had caused the need for a smack was wrong in a variety of possible ways…. the message got through, where as I have seen parents in more recent times spend ages explaining in words to the ir children why what they had done was wrong without successful out come … time out in their room proved no deterent either in most cases
In my own childhood I was given an occassional smack ( no fear there either but I never went back for a second dose ) am grateful looking back for those smacks . Before I married I was a pre-school teacher for many years and saw the concerned love of certain parents who delivered a smack.
I have had two sons and , in early days I did smack a couple of times at least … the boys understood what it was for … now that they are in their thirties we have a very close relationship … neither they nor have become violent people as some anti-smacking people would claim that we would have become.

Shallom and Happy New year as of next Friday to all.

I find it amazing the strongest advocates of smacking always argue with the most vehemence in their writing

that is because proponents of the right to smack (as a means of loving correction), recognize that those who oppose it are more interested in attacking traditional family values than the actual welfare of children.

Your attitude to smacking reflects your spirituality, is there no place for correction?

God is all loving so will not punish us either for our wrongs?
What is purgatory and hell for you, time out in the naughty chair?