‘…the most devoted child of the See of Peter…’

Marty has recently been reading Waugh; his excellent work on St Edmund Campion. Things were tough in the days when Campion and others tried to fight against the Great Apostacy of 16th century England.

Things are now, of course, very different. We are, especially in Lent and Easter, good friend with the Anglicans.

I suppose it is important to bear in mind a couple of things:

1. Heresy is a sin because of its nature it is destructive of the virtue of faith.

2. Privation of (the) faith is therefore a great evil.

Not that ecumenical moves are in themselves an evil – indeed – they are an important part of life in these post-conciliar times. But we must also acknowledge that the nominated christian faith, Catholicism, necessarily has pre-eminence and cannot be compromised, nor should Catholics be encouraged to do so.

The following quote of Edmund Campion gave me much pause for thought:

It was not our death that ever we feared. But we knew that we were not lords of our own lives, and therefore for want of answer would not be guilty of our deaths.

In condemning us you condemn all your own ancestors – all the ancient priests, bishops and kings – all that was once the glory of England, the island of saints, and the most devoted child of the See of Peter.

To be condemned with these lights – not of England only, but of the whole world – by their degenerate descendants, is both gladness and glory to us.

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    Comments: 27

    1. Teresina July 8, 2014 at 12:24 pm

      From St Peter and the Apostles down we have had martyrs for the Faith, as with the Reformation Catholics chose to die for their Catholic Faith.  To lump everyone into one term "Christian" as good enough is not good enough.  It is actually disdainful of the many saints and martyrs and implies really that their sacrifice was not necessary when in reality it was willed by God that they die for the truths of the Catholic Faith.  God is the same, yesterday, today and tomorrow.  He made the distinctions then and He makes the distinction now.  As Marty says "privation of [the] Faith is therefore a great evil". 

    2. Dominican July 8, 2014 at 2:46 pm

      Yes and every Ash Wednesday I am deprived of the  practice of my faith by the glad handing in the name of ecumenism with the Anglicans instead of an evening mass for the workers in my parish not to mention the socialising SUPPER !! afterwards.

      But then we so often hear "all religions are equal today.  WHO IS PUTTING THIS HERETICAL NOTION ABOUT?

    3. Dominican July 8, 2014 at 3:05 pm

      Just imagine how Catholic the world would be if England had stayed with Rome

    4. Don the Kiwi July 8, 2014 at 3:52 pm

      Yes Dominican.

      There is a danger in the ecumenism of today, that "ecumenism" is conflated with "indifferentism"  - that false teaching whereby all religions are considered equally true and equally lead to our salvation. This is also the case in our relationship with our protestant brothers and sisters; for although they recognise Christ as their redeemer and worship the One True God, and although their baptisms correctly administered are valid, They continue, nevertheless to endanger their souls through denial of the Truths of the One, Holy,Catholic and Apostolic Church. 

      We can see that error being added to and augmented in our day by all or most of the Protestants – or sections of them – accepting sodomy in the form of so called gay marriage - sodomy being equated with normal conjugal relations, acceptance of abortion, contraception ,and homosexual acts as being "normal behaviour", and the breakdown in morality generally through non-aceptance of Natural Law on which  objective morality is based.

    5. bamac July 8, 2014 at 5:00 pm

      Michael Voris has spoken along much th same lines as you don and dominican … he hits hard , it is no wonder that there is so much criticism of him in certain sectors!

      http://www.churchmilitant.tv/daily/?today=2014-07-07
      Thank you Marty for another worthwhile post,

      Mrs Mac

    6. MarkO July 8, 2014 at 8:01 pm

      There is none other, quite like the Catholic Church.  She has at her heart the Sacraments of Penance and the Eucharist.

      Satan fell from Heaven because of self-pride. He plotted to destroy God's Plan for man from that moment on. He took the form of a snake for a reason – a snake has fangs in it's mouth – with which he employed to inject his virus deeply into the fruit which Adam and Eve later ingested. Leaving behind only two tiny pin-pricks which Adam and Eve failed to indentify, having already been beguiled with certain false promises…..

      The Sacraments of the Eucharist and of Penance are God's perfect antidote to satan's virus – for when we take into bodies the very Body, Blood Soul and Divinity of our Jesus Christ when in a state of grace – we take into ourselves that which cancels out satan's virus.  No wonder the Church and her priests and her Sacraments are THE prime target of he who is evil.

    7. MarkO July 8, 2014 at 8:22 pm

      P.S. One thing I've noticed over many years, is how dissenting theologians tend to question Christ's resurrection very particularly – and also the dogma of transubstantiation. They are their "empty hell" theories in addition, have a done a great deal of damage to the True Church – helping to fuel the nonsense that the Catholic Church is just "one among many faiths" that are "to be considered".

    8. Teresina July 8, 2014 at 11:44 pm

      Yes, MarkO, all you say is so true.  It has to be remembered that the martyrs died for the Catholic Faith – not the Anglican faith.  If Anglicanism was a sure means of salvation then why did the martyrs have to die?  Being Christian alone does not guarantee salvation and that is what the Church is there for to bring people to eternal life.  Our Lord actually appeared in the cell of one of the English martyrs and offered him the Crown of Martyrdom.  Therefore, if Christ Himself offered the Crown of Martyrdom then there is something gravely wrong in the Anglican communion.

      For example, other Christian faiths (apart from the Orthodox) do not believe in the Sacrament of Penance but obviously they like everyone else can commit mortal sin – so how do they free themselves from that?  That would mean they are in grave danger of going to hell unless they make a perfect contrition before death.  Therefore, those in the Church commit a serious omission, and endanger their own souls, if they treat Anglicans and other faiths as mere buddies who have no necessity to convert to the Catholic Faith.

      That is the most important teaching since Vatican II that needs to be overturned.  The Church has always taught that outside the Church there is no salvation – the current interpretation is erroneous and could lead souls to hell.  It is just one of the many things that needs correction since Vatican II.  It has meant no need for missionaries – leave everyone as they are; no need for evangelisation – leave everyone as they are – athiests and all!

    9. Teresina July 9, 2014 at 12:08 am

      Mrs Mac, an excellent commentary on the situation of the Church from Michael Voris.

      Some statistics here on the decline in the Faith in England and Wales but it is the same virtually the world over.  It is a decline because the truth has not been taught for 50 years and people now see there to be no reason to be Catholic and while this idea pertains the churches will continue to be closed and sold off as Michael Voris says:  http://www.lms.org.uk/resources/statistics-from-the-catholic-directory

      And a comment on these statistics:

      "Dr Joseph Shaw, the Chairman of the Latin Mass Society, who led the research, comments:

      ‘Anyone with an interest in the future of the Catholic Church in England and Wales will find these figures illuminating. They show unambiguously that something went seriously wrong in the Church in England and Wales in the 1960s and 1970s. Catholics ceased quite suddenly to see the value of getting married, having large families, and having their children baptised. Non-Catholics no longer perceived the Church as the ark of salvation, and ceased to seek admission. Young men no longer offered themselves for the priesthood in the same numbers as before.

      ‘It is not fanciful to connect this catastrophe to the wrenching changes which were taking place in the Church at that time, when the Second Vatican Council was being prepared, discussed, and, often erronesouly, applied. As Pope Benedict wrote in the Motu Proprio Summorum Pontificum (2007):

      in many places celebrations were not faithful to the prescriptions of the new Missal, but the latter actually was understood as authorizing or even requiring creativity, which frequently led to deformations of the liturgy which were hard to bear. I am speaking from experience, since I too lived through that period with all its hopes and its confusion. And I have seen how arbitrary deformations of the liturgy caused deep pain to individuals totally rooted in the faith of the Church.

      ‘The theological and liturgical fashions of that era were invariably justified by the hope of positive pastoral results, and these results manifestly failed to materialise.

      ‘The effect of dissent from the Church’s teaching is particularly manifest in relation to contraception, which has had a direct consequence on the Catholic birth rate, as reflected in the number of baptisms, compared to the national birth rate.

      ‘The Church in England and Wales today has fewer than half the ordinations each year than it had in the 1860s, but more than double the number of priests. A large proportion of those priests, however, will die or have to stop work over the next decade. In this respect we are still living on our capital, and this capital is about to run out.

      ‘The Extraordinary Form has not lost its power to attract young men to the priesthood, and the communities which have grown up around it today provide disproportionate numbers of vocations, marriages, and baptisms. Thirteen young men from England and Wales are currently studying for the priesthood in the different religious orders committed to the Extraordinary Form; three more should join them in September; these are numbers which many dioceses would envy.

      ‘We believe that the Extraordinary Form (the Traditional Mass) has an important role to play in resolving the crisis in the Church.’"

    10. MarkO July 9, 2014 at 7:03 pm

      Spot on Teresina and well stated!  Like you I also have a great deal of respect for Micheal Voris – he is doing wonderful work.

      I have a vision for the Catholic Church.  That she return to the Latin Mass where reverence for Our Lord Jesus Christ is once again instilled in the congregation.  Where the Tabernacle is once again put right in the centre behind the altar where it belongs, where the priest once again faces the sanctuary offering to the Father the Sacrifice of the Son in atonement for our sins.

      A church in which a strong Marian devotion is an important feature and where the people are open to the gifts of her spouse, the Holy Spirit, just as in the days of the early Apostolic Church.

      A Church which is Holy and Perfect.  Then and only then, will God shower his gifts upon men, offering a solution to every problem imaginable.

       

    11. Teresina July 10, 2014 at 12:42 pm

      MarkO, I share that same vision and looking at how things are developing overseas I am sure that will come in time.  We have pockets of it, even in New Zealand.  In Christchurch there is great Marian devotion with the annual procession, we have adoration of the Blessed Sacrament in a number of different parishes and the number of Latin Masses are growing, especially in Auckland, Palmerston North and Christchurch and, after all, Summorum Pontificum is only seven years old.  Deo gratias for the vision of Benedict XVI!   

    12. MarkO July 10, 2014 at 6:27 pm

      Teresina, that's great news! Great things have small beginnings. God Bless. Mark

    13. withhope July 12, 2014 at 5:59 pm

      Bergoglio is continuing to work towards the One World Ecumenical Church which his immediate predecessors dreamed of:

      http://callmejorgebergoglio.blogspot.co.uk/2014/07/francis-evangelicals-prepare-for-one.html

      St Paul tells us that those who seek to 'dissolve Christ' are antichrists. What is a prelate who publicly lends his moral authority to falsehoods and misleads his flock?

      “You shall not bear false witness against your neighbour.” For Bergoglio to call a protestant a ‘brother bishop’ is to bear false witness. For a Catholic to worship with false-religionists is a sin against the first commandment (Wojtyla institutionalised Catholic worship with Baal (he insisted to the last that the 'spirit of assisi' he had raised, continue to be worshipped). Begoglio, like Wojtyla, is intending once again to publicaly apologise for the Mission of Christ (…this July I [bergoglio] will preach in his church [pentecostal prostestants] on a Sunday and offer an apology from my church [catholic?] for the hurt it has brought to their congregation…) Does Christ confess those who are ashamed of Him? Bergoglio calls the mission of this fathers in faith, ‘solemn nonsense’ – this is a denial of Christ's mission to the Apostles.

      And yet so-called ‘popes’ continue to lend their ‘immense moral authority’ to falsehoods, idolatry, denial and dishonour. And who cares? If someone approves of another’s sins, that someone participates in them.

      http://meetingthemets.com/2014/06/09/antichrist-has-shown-us-his-calling-card-do-you-care/

      St Edmund Campion, pray for us.

       

       

       

       

    14. Teresina July 12, 2014 at 8:00 pm

      Withhope, I read your article but it is an incongruous mix because on the one hand it complains about Pope Francis meeting with evangelicals yet on the other it quotes what Pope Francis said two days later which I would think you would agree with.  I can't see any problem with Pope Francis at least speaking to people of other faithfs because how on earth can we ever convert anyone if we hide our light under a bushel.  I can't see how you could disagree with anything in the following statement which I post from your link:

      "Here is what Francis  said only two days after meeting with the evangelicals at his general audience
       

      "There are those who believe they can maintain a personal, direct and immediate relationship with Jesus Christ outside the communion and the mediation of the Church. These are dangerous and harmful temptations…"

      "…On the contrary, you cannot love God without loving your brothers, you cannot love God outside of the Church; you cannot be in communion with God without being so in the Church, and we cannot be good Christians if we are not together with those who seek to follow the Lord Jesus, as one single people, one single body, and this is the Church."

       

    15. Teresina July 13, 2014 at 1:05 pm

      Here is a sermon of Bishop Athanasius Schneider on Holy Mass, persecution, and the Eucharist.  When I listen to this Bishop I hear things that I rarely ever hear.  His obvious faith shines through and I find what he has to say builds up my faith and I am sure that everyone who listens to him will find the same.  He says Catholics have much to blush about the lack of reverence to Our Lord and compares the respect shown by other faiths who, he points out, do not have the Real Presence that we have.  He asks us: why do we do to Our Lord what would offend us so much if it were done to us?  Why are we less sensitive when Our Lord's honour is at stake?

      The Archbishop sermon begins at 5.50

      http://te-deum.blogspot.co.nz/2013/01/homily-of-bishop-athanasius-schneider.html

      Bishop Schneider has written a wonderful little book called Dominus Est – it is The Lord and he is interviewed on EWTN about Communion in the hand and the abuses it had led to.  56 minutes and every minute worth listening to to build up your faith in the Real Presence, even if you think, like me, I believe so why bother listening to this?  I was awakened by him even more to the Real Presence:

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QbAZezVk5Gk

       

       

    16. withhope July 14, 2014 at 3:43 pm

      Teresina said: "I can't see any problem with Pope Francis at least speaking to people of other faithfs because how on earth can we ever convert anyone if we hide our light under a bushel."

       

      Bergoglio said: "I’m not interested in converting Evangelicals to Catholicism."

       

      with light like that who needs a bushel? Bergoglio likewise is not interested in converting Jews, Muslims or atheist of 'good will'.

    17. withhope July 14, 2014 at 4:08 pm

      Bergoglio has repeatedly taught non-catholics to stay put in their own false-beliefs (after all, isn't this the point of dialogue? to dissolve Christ and reaffirm the father of lies), whether that be atheism, judaism, islam, paganism, whatever; and this is what novus ordo catholicism  teaches as well, rendering itself worthless.

      1jn.2.22 Who is a liar, but he who denieth that Jesus is the Christ? This is Antichrist, who denieth the Father, and the Son. (many protestants deny the Christ as God-man, and all protestants, save the Orthodox, deny the Real Presence (it is one of the 39 articles of their fatih) and all Jews and of course deny the Son – whereas atheists deny any God, Muslims deny God the Father and God the Son – their God cannot be a Father, and has no Son).

      1jn.4.3 And every spirit that dissolveth Jesus, is not of God: and this is Antichrist, of whom you have heard that he cometh, and he is now already in the world. (this is exactly what the New Ecumenism is about, 'dissolving Christ' – it is the point of the Novus Ordo Mass and the Novus Ordo Priest and Novus Ordo Catechism and the Novus Ordo 'pope')

    18. Teresina July 14, 2014 at 6:25 pm

      Withhope, it is very difficult to know what Pope Francis is saying at any one given time because either he is contradicted by one or other of the cardinals who say he did not mean to say such and such as it has been written or taken out of context, or he says things himself which are completely contradictory.  And I agree with you to that we cannot have false ecumenism whereby it is said that evangelicals don't have to convert but there also seems to be the error about that we shouldn't have any dialogue with non-Catholics at all and that is not right either. 

    19. Teresina July 15, 2014 at 5:02 pm

      Being a most devoted child to the See of Peter, I feel bound to mention again a group which is doing well overseas and, if established in Hamilton, would be something to give the youth of this diocese a counter-balance to the exposure they get solely to guitars and charismatic worship.  There really is no alternative for the youth here or in fact most dioceses in New Zealand.  There was probably a similar situation pertaining in the US and so it is no wonder this group is flourishing there and I believe is doing well in the UK also:

      What On Earth Is Juventutem and Why Is it Spreading So Fast?

      While one foiled Black Mass at Harvard grabs all the headlines, young Catholics at Harvard (and in Chicago, Miami, DC, Michigan and beyond) have been busy introducing thousands to the Traditional Latin Mass.

      http://www.aleteia.org/en/religion/interview/what-on-earth-is-juventutem-and-why-is-it-spreading-so-fast-5269068210765824

    20. Teresina July 15, 2014 at 5:09 pm

      Just a little of their story:

      "A big highlight in their short history so far has been a Solemn High Mass in Boston in the Spring of 2013, celebrated by Fr. John Zuhlsdorf. Over 200 people attended this first “TLM” in decades,  illuminated by the artistry of the Choir of St. Paul—boys from the Boston Archdiocesan Choir School—and a professional male schola, which sang beautiful Renaissance polyphony by Victoria and Palestrina.

      If Juventutem has their way, such beauty is just the harbinger of things to come. Recently, four members—three Harvard students and one alum—sat down with Regina Magazine to tell us about Juventutem in the United States. Jim McGlone is a History major from New Jersey. Evan O’Dorney is studying mathematics; he’s originally from the San Francisco Bay area. Eileen Macron is a freshman from Staten Island, New York. Finally, Paul Schultz is a Harvard alum and a lawyer who is the Group Coordinator of the Michigan chapter of Juventutem and the Secretary of the Fœderatio Internationalis Juventutem.

      How did you first discover the TLM?

      Jim: I had never even heard that the traditional Mass existed before starting college. Two years ago, I attended one for the first time at Boston’s Cathedral of the Holy Cross. I wouldn’t say that I immediately fell in love with the Latin Mass, but I kept coming back and learning more about it. It wasn’t long before I was altar serving and doing whatever I could to promote the Latin Mass among my peers.

      Eileen: I attended my first Latin Mass when I was ten years old, because my father preferred this style of the Mass and we found a parish nearby that said the TLM. Although I was resistant at first, I soon grew to love and prefer the Mass.

      Paul: I grew up in a Lutheran family. In summer 2002 I attended a Traditional Latin Low Mass at Old St. Mary, Chinatown, DC. I hated that first Latin Mass. I hated that the church was so hot. I hated that I arrived late and couldn’t sit near my friend. I hated that I didn’t have a worship aid of any kind. I hated that I couldn’t even hear the Latin that was supposedly being whispered at the front of the sanctuary.

      By the time the liturgy was over, I was nearly ill with the strength of my perverse anger at these Catholics that I took to be idol worshipers violating the First Commandment.

      But this visceral response ultimately led to good. Having seen a church full of Catholics behaving like It Was True—that there really was the Body, Blood, Soul, and Divinity of Jesus Christ on that altar—I would ultimately have much more fruitful conversations with my pro-life friends the next Fall (particularly with one who is now a deacon) and would be received into the Church and become a weekly TLM attendee before nine more months had passed.

      What was it about the Mass that drew you?

      Jim: I was born and raised Catholic, and as I began college, I knew that I wanted to make my faith a priority after leaving home. I wasn’t sure at first how I would do that, but discovering the traditional Mass provided an answer.

      What I like best about the traditional Mass is the way it emphasizes participation through prayer.  It can be a lot like Adoration, in a way, but centered on receiving Communion as the focal point. The general tone of reverence, the natural, built-in periods of silence, and the way every item and action points toward the Eucharist and to Christ’s sacrifice on the cross: all of this, in my experience, makes it very easy to pray with the traditional Mass."

    21. withhope July 16, 2014 at 4:56 pm

      I don't think it's difficult to understand Bergoglio or Kasper and their ilk. They are humanists who have replaced Christ the King with man the god. The latest Remnant vid asks the ever crucial question, how can it be that neoconservative-catholics go along with with anything destructive to the Faith?

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cpBnZ2iUJfQ&feature=youtu.be

      I would guess if Catholics have convinced themselves that they must go along with anything that comes from Rome, no matter how antichrist, they will follow bishops to hell; they have surrendered their God-given discernment to recognise that Christ even has ANY enemies, let alone who they are. And many many people have yet to figure out that an enemy of Christ is an enemy of our very own fragile immortal souls. The choice that lies before us (especially clergy) should be crystal clear; but for all too many it will remain a pleasing mess of hegelian antichristisms wrapped up in a white cassock – plus way too many catholics want to be in the world and of the world and still believe heaven is assured. This is the sort of thinking that wants to believe no amount of abusing one's free will can sever us from the salvific grace of God – which is what Bergoglio teaches with bells on (it doesn't really matter if he believes it). To believe such a thing would be to disbelieve all of the popes and saints, the apostles prior to '58, and Christ.

    22. Teresina July 17, 2014 at 10:20 am

      Withhope, I don't think you can say neo-cons go along with everything that comes from Rome.  I think the discussions between the Wanderer and the Remnant – both papers run by members of the Matt family are perhaps an example of the situation I see – each side going too far one way.  The same with Pope Francis – some things he has said are good – some things he has said I totally reject as not following Catholic teaching.  The Pope can have an opinion and he can state that opinion but as Cardinal Burke has said the Pope's opinion cannot change Church teaching and until he endeavours to do that we have to sit and wait.  If he does change the teaching on divorce that will lead to a schism because I doubt even the neocons will accept that …

    23. bamac July 17, 2014 at 3:27 pm

      http://www.churchmilitant.tv/daily/?today=2014-07-16
      Another link to Vortex where Michael Voris makes statements similar to those I have read , at times, on B.F

      Mrs Mac

    24. Teresina July 18, 2014 at 10:16 am

      Thank you, Mrs Mac, I can only seem to access Michael Voris through your links.  I have heard a bit of what he says about the confusion in the Church too.

      Bishop Athanius Schneider says much the same thing but has gone further in saying that we are in the fourth crisis of the Church and that there is a danger of schism.  Here is part of what he says:

      "In his interview, Bishop Schneider said the “banal” and casual treatment of the Blessed Sacrament is part of a major crisis in the Church in which some laity and clergy, including some in positions of authority, are siding with secular society. At the heart of the problems, he believes, is the creeping introduction of a man-centred agenda, while in some churches God, in the tabernacle, really is materially put in a corner, while the priest takes centre stage. Bishop Schneider argued that this situation is now coming to a head. “I would say, we are in the fourth great crisis [of the Church], in a tremendous confusion over doctrine and liturgy. We have already been in this for 50 years.”

      How long will it last? “Perhaps God will be merciful to us in 20 or 30 years.”

      In the autumn, the synod of bishops will meet in extraordinary session to discuss the family, in the light of the questionnaire which Pope Francis invited the faithful to complete, giving their views on marriage and sexuality. Expectations are growing that rules will be relaxed on a range of sexual matters and in terms of divorced people receiving Communion as a sign of “mercy” from the Church.

      Such views, according to Bishop Schneider, reveal the depth of the problem. “I think this issue of the reception of Holy Communion by the remarried will blow up and show the real crisis in the Church. The real crisis of the Church is anthropocentrism and the forgetting of Christo-centrism…

      “This is the deepest evil: man, or the clergy, putting themselves in the centre when they are celebrating liturgy and when they change the revealed truth of God, for instance, concerning the Sixth Commandment and human sexuality.”"

      .

      http://www.catholicherald.co.uk/features/2014/06/06/bishop-athanasius-schneider-we-are-in-the-fourth-great-crisis-of-the-church/

    25. bamac July 18, 2014 at 5:02 pm

      Teresina,

      This Vortex is very much on topic too…. do wish that you could get it … willtry to find a way …

      http://www.churchmilitant.tv/daily/?today=2014-07-17

      God Bless,

      Mrs Mac

    26. Teresina July 18, 2014 at 5:50 pm

      Thanks, Mrs Mac, I can get on to the video when you paste up a link but otherwise I get a page which says "join up" or something similar.  I watched this video but I think Michael Voris is being overly kind to Pope Francis because the Pope spoke to this fellow Scalfari and there was an uproar over what Scalfari said the Pope had said.  Therefore, the fact that Pope Francis has again spoken to this same man – this time being quoted as saying there are 2% pedophile priests in the Church and there is a problem with celibacy – he would know whatever he said was likely to be misconstrued or taken out of context.  So the fact that, regardless of this, he did give an interview to this journalist, then says the Pope either is completely naive (which is highly unlikely) or he does intend for these comments to be published.  There are too many of these comments (as Michael Voris says) for there to be some kind of mistake.  To me it is an attempt to change Church teaching through media pressure – by ordinary Catholics in the pew being led to believe that change is about to take place.  If I was to give my honest opinion then, after a year in office, I believe that we have a liberal Pope in office.  I think some things he says are good, as regards the poor and loving neighbour, etc. but then St John Paul The Great and Benedict XVI have also said that.  What they haven't said is anything amounting to what we have heard purportedly said by Pope Francis.  Why has this problem only occurred in the papacy of Pope Francis?  Bishop Schneider says that we are likely to head into schism.  It remains to be seen which way Pope Francis is going to go on the issue of divorce which is likely to be the tipping point.  I think at the moment we have some bishops and Cardinals, including Cardinal Burke, correcting what Pope Francis is purported to have said, but even they are not going to keep that up and Pope Francis is going to have to make a clear signal – standing on his own two legs – as to which way he is going.  At the moment I believe he is trying to change Catholic opinion without being seen blatantly to be doing so.  What he is doing is wrong in any event speaking loosely to the media the way he does.

    27. Teresina July 21, 2014 at 6:52 pm

      Look at the can of worms Pope Francis has opened now with his loose comments on celibacy:

      "The Pontiff's views have been hailed as "refreshing" and "uplifting" by a large number of priests here.

      "It's a new way of looking at things and it makes total sense," Fr Seamus Ahearne of the Association of Catholic Priests told the Sunday Independent. "We raised the question of celibacy with the bishops in the early days of June as an issue to be looked at and the fact that Pope Francis has opened that discussion matters. Our view would be that Christ takes flesh in the messiness of everyday life. The wider the ministry the better, it's the mixture that is necessary.

      "It can't just be male – old males, celibate males – it has to be a mixture of male, female, young people, old people, married people and unmarried people, anyone," he added."

      See more at:

      http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/news/irish-priests-back-pope-francis-comments-on-end-to-celibacy-30444504.html#sthash.AwNkr05F.dpuf

      "We raised the question of celibacy with the bishops in the early days of June as an issue to be looked at and the fact that Pope Francis has opened that discussion matters. Our view would be that Christ takes flesh in the messiness of everyday life. The wider the ministry the better, it's the mixture that is necessary. – See more at: http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/news/irish-priests-back-pope-francis-comments-on-end-to-celibacy-30444504.html#sthash.AwNkr05F.dpuf